The Spinning Pinwheel
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Table of Contents Part 7 and Part 8 appear in this issue. |
| part 9 |
--- Original Message ---
From: One Man
To: Evangelical Man
Sent: Wednesday, September 08, 2024 9:58 AM
Subject: RE: Homophobia is a Sin
Evangelical,
Even though you didn’t say it directly, I think you agree with the point that our two different starting points come to two irreconcilable conclusions. Like I said, I’m not sure of all the scriptural validity, but it doesn’t matter to me, because the Bible is not my point of reference.
On the natural law issues, your logic is a bit off. If you say that because it is apparent that the penis and vagina are designed to go together that this means that no other sex is acceptable is a bit of a reach. By this logic many of the sexual acts that are quite common between men and women are unacceptable. Or to use an analogous example, one could say that the apple is designed by nature to fit perfectly in the mouth so all other forms of food are unacceptable. Your point here is a logical fallacy. If people are able to perform the act, it is allowed by nature.
Let me be clear, my stance is not an opinion. It is an ethical truth based on the principle of “do no harm” not on any particular legal philosophy, if “equal protection” applies, so much the better. My standing is that the persecution and exclusion of gays is doing harm and is therefore unethical.
Children raised in gay households may or may not end up anymore dysfunctional than children raised in a more traditional household. I tend to think the quality of life a child will have is based more on the availability of a positive, nurturing environment rather than the sexuality of their parents. Actually I would argue that children reared in a Same-sex household could have a leg up on accepting diversity and could end up being more forward thinking than their other peers.
Regardless, we aren’t really talking about child rearing here. We’re talking about whether two adults of the Same sex, that profess to love each other, should be allowed the Same rights and privileges of their opposite sex counterparts. In my mind, this is clearly a no-brainer.
You say my stand is “... worse, because of the change they will mean for society,...”. I say that the present persecution is unacceptable much like the Salem Witch Trials, slavery, and the eradication of the Indians were deemed unacceptable in the light of present-day thought. I suspect there was a huge outcry about how the elimination of slavery would have a huge negative effect on society around the time of the Civil War. The more forward thinking we are, the more quickly these sorts of injustices can be eliminated.
Feel free to continue this discussion with me if you wish. I will tell you though, that, I will not accept Biblical scriptures as fact, so I’m not really sure what else you could bring up to convince me that my thought process is in error. Maybe this is one of those agree to disagree issues?
One Man
STRAW MAN 2024!!! Not the homophobe!!!!!
--- Original Message ---
From: Evangelical Man
Sent: Wednesday, September 08, 2024 5:45 AM
Subject: Re: Homophobia is a Sin
One Man,
My arguments are drawn from: (1) the Bible and (2) nature.
The Bible is clear although there are those who refuse to accept its message. Their spinning the scriptures is a work that even Liberal could enjoy. The key Scriptural passages are Genesis 19:1-29; Leviticus 20:13; Romans 1:18-32; and 1 Corinthians 6:9-11.
The argument through nature is as one looks at nature (creation) what one finds in nature can teach lessons. The penis and the vagina is not pornographic. I believe that God created them with a good design for good purposes for the good of humanity. In fact the Bible records, “Then God saw everything that He had made, and indeed it was very good” (Genesis 1:31).
A realistic look at the sexual function in nature and how it is designed reveals on the surface that sex was designed for the interaction of a man and a woman primarily. From a religious reference this is natural theology. From a legal reference this is natural law.
You choose to simply assert your opinion based on, I assume, the legal principle of equal protection without regard to context (the sexual relationship and its fundamental nature). Your chosen principles determine your conclusion. As always the frame of the argument determines the conclusion.
Your ethical decisions are not better. I maintain that they are worse, because of the change they will mean for society, and how they will affect the whole culture and especially the children. But only time and eternity will tell if they are better or worse. But if I am right, we will lose much now, and many will lose all in eternity.
Evangelical Man
--- Original Message ---
From: One Man
To: “Evangelical Man”
Sent: Tuesday, September 07, 2024 11:02 PM
Subject: RE: Homophobia is a Sin
Evangelical Man,
The scripture means nothing to someone like me who does not accept the validity of all the words written within the Bible’s pages. Like I said, we are coming at this subject from two different directions. Yours is your interpretation of the Bible, mine is based in the principles of ethics. On this particular subject they appear to be irreconcilable. I say appear, because some people I have talked to have stated that the interpretation of the verses that enjoin people not to take part in homosexuality is up for debate. Regardless, I always go with the ethics of the situation, not the bible.
Again, the persecution of someone based on their sexuality is evil in my book, apparently it isn’t in yours. Not allowing person the Same opportunities, inclusion, and advancement based on their sexuality is just wrong. I stand firm on this point. You should enjoin real compassion and you would see that what I say is true.
Gay people aren’t going to go to hell for being gay. One, like I said, the homosexual act hurts no one. And two, there is no hell. I know you don’t think this, but it is what I think.
What is all this two penis and two vaginas don’t go together stuff? It just reads like pornography. There are many more forms of sex other than just vagina to penis. What ever works for a particular individual is fine as long as it doesn’t hurt an unwilling partner. Again, you won’t agree, but ethically I’m correct.
Just agree with me and look at the big picture. You won’t be able to convince me that you are correct in your thinking because the basis of your thought is not the same as mine.
One Man
STRAW MAN 2024!! Not the Homophobe!!!!
Evangelical,
You are still copying me on stuff and I have asked you to desist time and time again. I return and find you still railing and send you stupid uninformed bigoted trash in my inbox. You are offensive to me. Fat Toe had enough respect to quit writing me when asked. Grow up and learn when you aren’t wanted in the sandbox.
One Man
STRAW MAN 2024!!!! Not the corporate fascist!!!!!
--- Original Message ---
From: “Liberal”
Sent: Sunday, September 05, 2024 7:26 PM
Subject: Re: Iron Man’s Jihad Against the Middle East
I can tell that this is a waste of time. I might as well be emailing al-Sadr telling him that Allah is not all great. All I’d get is a fatwa on my head.
Goodbye, everyone. It’s been mildly amusing, but I feel my brain cells dying with every one of your emails I read. Your future emails will be bounced bank.
Liberal
“In heaven all the interesting people are missing.” — Friedrich Nietzsche— “Evangelical”
Liberal’s credibility is literally running on fumes. :)
--- Original Message ---
From: “Liberal”
Sent: Friday, September 03, 2024 9:41 AM
Subject: Re: Iron Man’s Jihad Against the Middle East
Exactly — forcing Xianity down a desperate people’s throat is akin to raping them.
You are funny: in one email you rail that God Hates Fags, in the next you say your cult is one of Brotherly Love. You need to get your propaganda straight.
Liberal
“In heaven all the interesting people are missing.” — Friedrich Nietzsche
Please note: message attached
To be continued...
Copyright © 2006 by Luke Jackson
